Discusssion I have never seen before

A'nen Sedjet wrote:Let's take the food analogy a step further (or back depending on how you see it): what if you were to eat what you, personally harvest? What if you hunted your own game and fed and clothed your family with it? What I'm getting at here is I think sitting in a fancy restaurant and being served removes one from the immediacy of food as a ritual and thus removes one further from interaction with the Divine. Maybe I'm nutz!

A'nen , that's a good example of those who go to psychics or magicians to solve their personal problems ( eating in a restaurant is more passive than to arrange your own meal ).
In this case you are all in the hands of others and take risk of getting the soup on your trousers because of a bad waiter , or get the wrong meal if you fail to express what you really need and many other risks too

In Spain we have a saying that is usually applied to situations where it's just better to do things yourself:

"I cook it, I eat it"



This said, I believe both ritualizing and not ritualizing for exterting your Will. Will is what's important here and everything else is a vehicle for it.

Maxx wrote:Thank you, Victor. A very informative message. But could you give me an example of what you are talking about in regard to the more advanced use of Magic as mentioned in the Asetian Bible. As I was reading your answer, I could see weather being manipulated like that, but that is one of the easiest things in magic to accomplish. I have to do that all the time in my work. So I know you were not referring to weather. Please zero in a little more with an example.

I don't fully agree with you that a direct manipulation of weather is that simple as one of the easiest things in magic to accomplish. It requieres a lot of energy and a lot of projection. I personally can have better results far more easily in a direct application of active magick, like for example making someone collapse and fait with a single energy strike with a wand. And that I believe can serve your question on examples as well, anything that you do with a wand in a non ritualistic manner, I believe it can be considered active magick. Things like instantly changing someone's thoughts, fully shutting down a main Shen center, making someone pass out, or to shield someone actively. All those are examples of active magick I believe. Some can be accomplished by other means and techniques, others cannot. The wand, wether mineral or wood, is an amplifier that allows for specific energy projections where the Will alone cannot go through our regular energy centers. So it needs to be amplified for a stronger signal and to apply the correct vibration. As I said in my other post, it is actually a science... an occult one, but nevertheless a science.
Also in the case of wanding, it is not like simply waving a wand and applying our Will to it. It is much more than that. It needs the techniques, the initiations, the sigils... it is a process. However, it is a scientific process of metaphysics, not a ritual one, since those things are there for a reason and not to create the proper atmosphere as in a ritual.

Good. That makes your words a little more easily understood. Thanks for the clarity. However, we do disagree about the weather. That
is what beginning magicians begin to practice in order to see changes right before their eyes. Manipulation of the clouds and the wind and the rain, etc. is very enjoyable for me. Maybe that is why and how I see magic easier without ritual than with it. Lying on your back manipulting clouds and calling in the rainclouds is how I began to practice. Something like the book ILLUSIONS by the guy who wrote the Seagull book.

Regards,

Maxx